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Moving to bottom of tank and dying :(
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keithg
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Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Location: NW Washington

PostPosted: 2005.04.25(Mon)22:11    Post subject: Moving to bottom of tank and dying :( Reply with quote

First off - this forum has been very informational to me! I have found one topic here that seemed similar to the problem I am experiencing, but didn't find any new information that could help me.

I started my 24 gallon tank about three months ago and as of last Wednesday I had five glolite tetras, two bleeding heart tetras, three black skirt tetras, two gold tetras, and two chinese algae eaters.

I started losing fish late this last week - I first noticed my bottom feeders staying at the bottom of the tank last Wednesday night (five days ago) and the others slowly followed. On Thrusday morning one of my bottom feeders was dead lying on the bottom of the tank, Thursday night, the other was dead wedged between a plant. Last night (day four) I lost one of my bleading hearts and a gold.

All the fish have moved to the bottom of the tank and appear to be breathing more heavily than they had in the past and they have not been eating. Now, after about three days, I notice they are begining to lose color.

I was first told by a local shop that I had nitrite problems, but I tested my water that same night and only had 0.25. Regardless I did a 30% water change and lost the two tetras the next day. Nitrites are now next to zero.

I have been told of numerous theories from water temperature (which has been at 79) being too high, to needing to add salt, to flukes and gill disease, ad hoc. I did turn the temp down to 77.

Has anyone experienced such a problem and have a solution? I am concerned of over medicating them and feel like all I can do is try this and that and hope something works.... Any help is greatly appreciated!

My tank information:
24 gallon tank established about three months
77 degrees, 6.8 pH; 0 Ammonia; 0 Nitrites
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hs
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Joined: 20 Dec 2003

PostPosted: 2005.04.26(Tue)5:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is probably not so much help, but just to clarify some things. Because I think you are right in thinking that medication might just add problems to the situation unless you really know what you are medicating for.

There's two options, - one is - still - water quality - two - a disease of some sort.
With your tank only being three months old, I would think it could be something in the setup, - meaning filtration, waterquality etc. If theres was any problem in that, this would be the time it would 'come forward'.

1. - I wonder that you say, nitrite is 'next to zero', because it should be zero without a doubt
Have you also testet nitrate, and ammonium..??
What kind of filtration do you have ?
If you have a pump, where is it situated, how about oxygen?? Is it creating enough movement of the tank surface to keep the level of oxygen sufficient??
Found all dead fish in there??

2. - If its a disease, it might have been brought in buy new fish, - have you any of those??
Are there any other signs than what you have already mentioned??

Did you add something to the tank recently, like plants, decoration, stones etc. ??

Did you test your tapwater, any problems with that maybe??

Its just some questions to put more light on the situation, -
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keithg
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Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Location: NW Washington

PostPosted: 2005.04.27(Wed)1:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the few tidbits. I am not certain how to answer the filtration question. I recieved an L125 filter from my mother in-law and am using that.

The nitrite level was between 0 and 0.25, but I did a water change last night and it is now at zero. I had not been checking my nitrates, so picked up a test kit and found that it is at 3ppm, from what I understand that is OK. I also have a stone in the bottom center of the tank for bubbles...

The rocks have been in the tank since day one. The neons are the most recent additions and have been in the tank for about a month. I hadn't planned on adding any more, but looks like my plans might be changing a bit.

Four fish so far have died. Two the first couple days and two more a couple days later. Did not lose anymore fish today, but one of them is turning very white. Could this mean it's velvet? I dropped a couple peas in the tank and a small pinch of food and a few of them ate up rather than ignoring it.
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hs
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Joined: 20 Dec 2003

PostPosted: 2005.04.27(Wed)14:04    Post subject: Reply with quote

this whiteness, - is it like something is on the fish, like a fine layer of flower, or dust, - then it could be velvet, ( odinium,) -

http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/disease/p/velvet.htm

Maybe look at this link, I think it does sound like the symptoms you have, - but it depends on whether you think the whiteness is like that,- and not a general loss of colour.

through the link you can also look up other diseases, such as neon tetra disease, which I quess its not, but the loss of colour made me think of that too.
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keithg
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Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Location: NW Washington

PostPosted: 2005.04.28(Thu)0:27    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm started a treatment for velvet today. One of the fish is white (kinda like a white dust) on his lower half. I havent lost anymore fish in a couple days now...
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Huntress
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Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Location: Houston TX

PostPosted: 2005.04.28(Thu)7:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does the "dust" look like grains of salt or is it more like a powder? I'd say the nitrites helped to suppress the immune system which allowed opportunistic diseases like velvet or ich to surface. Nitrites will impede gill function and ultimately cause the fish to suffocate, but also before that happens, the fish will be putting all it's fighting ability into trying to breathe which will allow secondary infections to surface.
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Fishies4Carole
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Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Location: Missouri ~ USA

PostPosted: 2005.04.28(Thu)11:08    Post subject: How about your pH?? Reply with quote

Hi! Keithg ~

You didn't mention having Neon Tetras, so as I was reading over your posts and the replies I was thinking maybe your pH is too low??

Huntress, what do you think about the pH in Keithg's tank? My community tank has platies, black-skirt tetras, a pair of swordtails, and cory catfishes ~ I keep my tank at around pH 7.4 ~ and everyone is doing fine.

Right now I'm fighting what looks like *velvet* on my female Cory catfish and one of my younger Platies, too.

A little extra salt helps, too, doesn't it??
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keithg
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Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Location: NW Washington

PostPosted: 2005.04.30(Sat)13:15    Post subject: Reply with quote

I misspoke about the neons. I was referring tot he five glolites mentioned in my first post.

The treatment for I still havent lost any more fish, but they are still sticking to the bottom of the tank and not eating much. I tried pulling them up near the top of the tank for a few minutes each, but they just head right back near the bottom :(
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Hasi
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Joined: 16 Apr 2005
Location: Australia - Melbourne

PostPosted: 2005.04.30(Sat)13:51    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it is the tetras losing colour try a immediate 20 - 25 % water change. 2 of my neons and one black tetra started to 'fade' in colour but I caught on the same night that it was happening so I guess I was lucky. I did an immediate 25% water change and the next morning they had their colour back.

This might not be much help but I just thought I'd let you and others know, BUT I didn't know any better and was told by lfs to add fish after a week of setting up my tank Mad luckily I have done a lot of reading and I am on top of things now.
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