Aquarium & Tropical Fish Site

This repository is for research only. New discussions take place in our current Tropical Fish Forum.

Archivarium 2004
Repository of our 2003/2004 Topics
 
  HelpHelp   Search BoardSearch Board   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   Check your private messagesCheck your private messages   Log inLog in   RegisterRegister 
How Many Fish to A Tank Arguement --- A New Perspective
 Forum Index > Aqua Lounge  Search Board
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
deseyered
Members


Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Location: California

PostPosted: 2005.02.26(Sat)5:46    Post subject: How Many Fish to A Tank Arguement --- A New Perspective Reply with quote

I've been wandering around the internet on the fish boards browsing and being completely in shock at some of the combinations of fish that people will put together.

The best arguement I've seen.. bar none from a poster at http://www.cichlidforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11858:

punkypuffer wrote:
"Most don't disregard other pets in this manner... It's easy with fish because you're completely seperate from them; sealed off...what if that weren't the case? You couldn't then justify raising a Doberman, a Mastiff, two St. Bernards, seven Dachsunds, a German Shephard, a Great Dane, an Irish Wolfhound, a Weimereiner and four Basset Hounds with a cat, in your bedroom could you? Of course not. Nobody would do that. Why? BECAUSE IT'S A REALLY BAD IDEA!"


Pretty much... that says it all.
_________________
The Cichlid Idiot at :http://www.cichlid-idiot.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
LittleMousling
Advisors


Joined: 30 Dec 2004
Location: WNY, USA

PostPosted: 2005.02.26(Sat)9:03    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed. And worst of all, you actually hear people bragging about their unconventional, dangerous mixes - I doubt if they're singing the same tune six months later, although many think it's fairly normal to have fish kill each other or lose fish without any apparent cause.
_________________
-Molly
Finsout.com! Shelldwellers.com!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
deseyered
Members


Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Location: California

PostPosted: 2005.02.26(Sat)9:59    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you think about it... letting fish kill each other off like that... it's kind of like rooster fights (where they put blades on their feet) or pitbull fighting.

Pretty much no one thinks those practices are humane.

Yet people do this to the fish all the time. Sad.. really sad.
_________________
The Cichlid Idiot at :http://www.cichlid-idiot.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Syno
Regulars


Joined: 26 Oct 2004
Location: Manchester, United Kingdom

PostPosted: 2005.02.26(Sat)14:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree, although I find that it's often new fishkeepers or just plain ignorant people who have these dangerous mixes of fish. I stated in an earlier post that when I worked in a fish shop a guy about my age would come in and buy fish for his tank which housed a 9" Tiger Tilipia, and I knew he wasn't putting these fish in as feeder fish, he was just putting them in to watch them be mudered by the Tilipia. Knowing what he was upto, I refused to sell him fish, his answer was 'your a nancy' and started laughing. The fact that this guy thought it was a joke, and got pleasure from this, made me very annoyed. Luckily I got the last laugh, because a few weeks later this guy brought his Tilipia back to the shop, because it had given him a nasty bite when he was cleaning is tank!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
violentray
Regulars


Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Location: Macomb, IL

PostPosted: 2005.03.08(Tue)22:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

letting the fish kill each other is inhumane I agree. but what if you let nature take its course when fish spawn or give live birth.

when my pregnant molly gives birth I have no choice but the let the young try to survive on their own. the molly giving birth could possibly make 30-45 fish in a 5 gallon tank so I would be way over stocked.

is letting the other fish eat the young inhumane as well.

what if you had no plans for them to spawn, it just happened.

is letting the parents eat their young justifyable??
_________________
never let your girlfriend watch your fish for the weekend.

RIP - 6 neons, and a betta
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address
Syno
Regulars


Joined: 26 Oct 2004
Location: Manchester, United Kingdom

PostPosted: 2005.03.09(Wed)5:06    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose it's a different situation when you have Livebearers and their young. What I think what deseyered means is mixing fish that will be totally incompatibile or having too many aggressive fish in the same tank, which will result in fights, injuries, and deaths. I've have to admit though I've been on the Your Tanks section of Cichlid forum, and there are some crazy mixes of fish in some peoples tanks. I think sometimes people undervalue fish compared with other pets, which sort of brings us back to deseyered's example with the dogs. Nobody sane would do that with dogs, but people seem to do it with fish. Heres an example in fish terms -

All the fish are semi adults. The Cichlids are all 3" and the Perruno is 5"
1 Texas Cichlid, 1 Jack, 2 Auratus, 2 Kenyi, 1 Oscar, 1 Jewel and a Perruno Catfish in one 20 gallon tank.

Now I think most experienced fishkeepers would know this is a disaster waiting to happen. But some people do mixes like that. Even having the Jack and the Texas together could result in disaster in a cramped space. But people seem to do it. I feel the reaons is, a lot of people like I said before are ignorant, and their answer to it is 'well their just fish'. My answer is no their not just fish. They are still living creatures, just like dogs. So show them respect. When you buy a dog you would research into whether it was a suitable dog for you to have, and that would be able to handle all it's needs. I think it's safe to say most people would do that. If thats the case, then we should learn to do it with fish too.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
number6
Moderators


Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Location: Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: 2005.03.09(Wed)10:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a huge difference between an unorthodox mix of fish and a cruel mix if fish.

Little mousling, define success in a dangrous mix of fish.
If I keep fish in an unorthodox and potentially dangerous to the fish setting for 2 yrs? 5? 10?
If they produce multiple broods?

There is nothing definitvely wrong in mixing incompatible fish. What makes it wrong in most cases is the 'most likely' result, plus your intentions. It is what is in your mind that changes it from not normal to 'wrong'.

If it is most probable that in a setup a fish will be maimed, get sick, die, etc. and you disregard that probability and do it because it pleases you, then you are a "fish haver". Mad

If you take all steps to avoid problems and do what it takes, well, that becomes like keeping a German Sheppard and a cat together in the same room. Not normal, but the dog can be trained.
How many people do you guys bash for owning a dog and cat together in the same house?

The problem with generalizations is just that. They are generalizations and assumptions.

Pinky puffers arguement is inane. All it does it take away credibility from the very real arguements in specific cases.

There are NO golden rules on stocking.
_________________
Discus Man is gone... I remain... #6... I am not a number I am a free man!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Steve Hampton
Moderators


Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: 2005.03.09(Wed)11:05    Post subject: Reply with quote

Discus Man wrote:

There are NO golden rules on stocking.


Maybe in freshwater, in a reef tank there are very specifc golden rules on stocking...again those pesky generalizations. Wink
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
number6
Moderators


Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Location: Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: 2005.03.09(Wed)11:27    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve Hampton wrote:
Discus Man wrote:

There are NO golden rules on stocking.


Maybe in freshwater, in a reef tank there are very specifc golden rules on stocking...again those pesky generalizations.

Are there really Shocked
I admit to knowing nothing about Salt Water so I'll believe you until a future day.

So there are few to no exceptions in reef tanks? Is this because of the myriad of symbiotic relationships in reefs?

I have been wanting to setup a live rock tank (no fish or just a clown fish or something) and refugium just to see what grows with minimal interference. This gives me yet another motivator...
Smile
_________________
Discus Man is gone... I remain... #6... I am not a number I am a free man!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Steve Hampton
Moderators


Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: 2005.03.09(Wed)17:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

Discus Man wrote:

I admit to knowing nothing about Salt Water so I'll believe you until a future day.

So there are few to no exceptions in reef tanks?


There are no exceptions to certain golden rules regarding stocking reef tanks. Some of those are based on symbiotic relationships, some on lighting, some on the availability to maintain live foods, some on extremely aggressive predation, etc. Unlike freshwater, with reef tanks there are gobs of fish, invertebrate, and lighting combinations that will never work...no exceptions.

Quote:

I have been wanting to setup a live rock tank (no fish or just a clown fish or something) and refugium just to see what grows with minimal interference. This gives me yet another motivator...
Smile


Be warned, once you start the slide onto the darkside of fishkeeping you may end up falling head first. It starts with just live rock. Then add a refugium. Then maybe just a few soft corals and then before long you're wanting to take out a second mortgage on your home to buy a huge tank and enough lights to light a baseball field at midnight. Sure, you try to resist, but the force too strong.

Seriously, setting up a nano tank can be extremely fun and incredibly interesting. I'm fortunate to live in Florida and can pickup live rock the same day it's harvested from the Gulf of Mexico near Tampa. The amount and diversity of life on a single piece of fresh live rock is shocking. I've managed to resist making the switch back to salt water on a large scale. I have a small 30 gallon reef with a 10 gallon refugium that's only about 8 months old. I vow to not get further entrenched in the "darkside". But it can be tough, especially since my daughter works at the best Salt Water fish store in the city and I get really really good discounts. I've kept salt water off and on since 1978 when it was really really tough to just keep fish alive reefs were considered only possible for the very effluent..
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
 Forum Index > Aqua Lounge All times are GMT - 6 Hours Search Board
Jump to:  
  You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2008 phpBB Group

oF <=> oC in <=> cm G <=> L