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Advice on fuzzy lips!
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lisam
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Joined: 09 Mar 2010

PostPosted: 2010.06.22(Tue)4:05    Post subject: Advice on fuzzy lips! Reply with quote

I am hoping for some assistance with disease identification & advice on a course of action.

30 gallon tank

Current parameters (API liquid tests)
Ammonia = 0
Nitrite = 0
Nitrate = 10 ppm
pH = 7.6
Temp = 78 deg. F

Current stocking:
6 Harlequin Rasboras,
5 (now 4) Three Striped African Catfish (~1.5
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nikelodeon79
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Joined: 08 Nov 2007
Location: Wisconsin, U.S.A.

PostPosted: 2010.06.22(Tue)4:56    Post subject: Reply with quote

It could be a fungal infection... but with the inverts I agree it would be risky to treat the whole tank.

The white fuzzy growth sounds like Columnaris... but as you stated it is usually a very fast moving disease. I had an entire tank nearly wiped out and fish would be fine one day and dead the next... while other fish were left seemingly untouched.

What I would do, in case it is columnaris (you don't want to mess around with that disease), is what Dusko recommended to me in my old columnaris thread:

Dusko wrote:
What I would do in such cases, I would vacuum the substrate VERY VERY well, do a large (90%) water change (in the whole Betta section which is connected to one sump filter). I add dechlorinated water to the tank (similar temp + - 2'C)
I also re-dose with GH Booster for extra Ca and especially Mg (my tap way too soft).
I lower the temp to 24'C (aparrently lower temp help with preventing columnaris), I also try to improve the surface agitation for extra O2.
Low O2 can be one of the reasons.

I tried salt and Ektozon aquarium salt from Hobby but doesn't seem to work AT ALL.

Over all hygiene, good O2 levels (8ppm), GH at 5-8dH (electrolytes), and good diet (flakes loose their nutritional value once opened very fast and for that reason I buy only small quantities which I use up fast enough).


Here's the link to the thread: http://www.aquahobby.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=53144&highlight=columnaris
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lisam
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Joined: 09 Mar 2010

PostPosted: 2010.06.22(Tue)21:40    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your advice - just got done reading through the linked thread. I'm so sorry you lost so many fish! Crying or Very sad

I will increase my water change frequency & amount. I have an Emperor 280 that seems to give pretty good surface agitation, but I will leave the tank's water level a bit lower to futher increase it. My GH = 5 & KH = 3, so I don't think I need to do anything there.

One quick question about turning down the temp in the tank. If this is actually a fungal infection VS Columnaris, will lowering the temp negatively effect the situation? Anything else I should be doing if it is a fungal infection?

Both affected fish remain happy & otherwise healthy at this point... Confused

Oh, another thing that I forgot to mention - the recently added shrimp are the only thing in tank that were NOT quarantined. I came home from work that day & found that my husband had just dumped them into the tank (including all the water they came in). When I asked him, he said that yes, there were some fish in the tank that the shrimp had come from. Bad hubby! Mad

If you can think of anything else I should be doing please let me know.

Thanks!
Lisa

Edit: forgot to mention - I feed flake food as a daily staple & provide various frozen foods weekly. There is also a remnant population of blackworms living in the gravel from a batch I added about a month ago (the frogs are slowly hunting them all down, but I don't think the catfish or rasboras ate them except for the day they were added).
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nikelodeon79
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Location: Wisconsin, U.S.A.

PostPosted: 2010.06.23(Wed)7:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think lowering the temp a smidge would hurt any... except if you were dealing with ich when you want to raise the temps.
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lisam
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PostPosted: 2010.06.30(Wed)11:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, the two rasboras with the fuzz on their lower lips continue to thrive (eating well, schooling, good color etc.), but today I came home to find one of my Oto's laying on his side. He's not dead yet, but I don't have high hopes. Sad

About 2 days ago, I noticed that the other Oto had one small white spot (looked like a grain of salt) on his tail, but no other signs of trouble. Before I left for work this morning, both were happily cleaning the plants and tonight the one with the spot no longer has it & is still very active & eating.

I'm starting to get a bit paranoid. I've been doing water changes daily (OK, I skipped one day over the weekend when I was out of town), I repeated all my tests (shook my bottles like crazy), and I removed the phosphate absorber that I had added just before all these problems started, just in case that has anything to do with what's going on.

One other thing to mention - not sure if it's relevant. A day or two after I added the phosphate absorber I also noticed a bunch of tiny (~2 mm) white spheres/dots that seemed to be appearing in depressions in driftwood & rocks. They seem to be multiplying, but very slowly. I've tried to get some good pictures, but haven't had any luck. They seemed fairly benign, so I've been putting off posting about them, but could they have something to do with the situation?

Just not sure what else to do at this point, other than continue on with water changes etc. Sad
Anyone out there have any thoughts as to what might be going on here?
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nikelodeon79
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PostPosted: 2010.06.30(Wed)13:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not familiar with phosphate absorbers... I've never used one. Why are you wanting to absorb phosphate?

Otos are extremely sensitive fish... so it may not be a disease that he is suffering from. How long have you had the otos?

I've found that my tanks seem to have a "limit" and once I exceed the limit, bad things happen. It could simply be that your over the edge of fully stocked... and once your numbers are down things may level off.
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lisam
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PostPosted: 2010.06.30(Wed)21:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your quick reply!

The Otos have both been in the tank for over 3 months.

The phosphate absorber is at the advice of the LFS - I took in some algae covered plants for ID since I could not find an online picture that looked like it. He said that most likely phosphates were high & rec. Phos-zorb from API. I tested & found phosphates at 1 ppm, so I added it to the filter. I rinsed it a lot before adding it, but found that the water still became somewhat cloudy when I restarted the filter. I'm hoping it didn't irritate gills etc. Does anyone have any experience with this product?

Thanks,
Lisa
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nikelodeon79
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PostPosted: 2010.07.01(Thu)5:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

It just seems odd to be removing phosphates... since your tank is planted. I actually dose phospates in my planted tanks! Sounds like more misinformation by the LFS and just another gimmick made by companies out to make a few bucks. Confused I could be wrong, however... I'm definitely no expert. I googled phosphate absorbers and they seem to be geared more for marine aquariums... and perhaps non-planted freshwater.

The addition of chemicals (I'm assuming the phosphate absorber contains some sort of chemical) could definitely be enough to stress fish and cause disease/deaths.. particularly sensitive fish like otos. I think removing it was a good decision.
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lisam
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PostPosted: 2010.07.06(Tue)12:06    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, so far so good. Everyone acting fine & the fuzz on the one Rasbora is gone. The remaining Oto is looking great & the single white spot on his tail is gone. Still questioning what the other little white spots are all over the wood, but will start a new post (hopefully with some pics) for that.

I'm going to cautiously back off on the water changes, maybe twice weekly VS daily, and see how it goes.

Have done some more reading on the algae situation & I think you're right about the poor advice - sort of a bummer, since my LFS usually is spot-on with advice. Sad

Thanks for all your support nikelodeon79!!

Lisa Smile
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edwarlock
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Joined: 29 May 2010

PostPosted: 2011.01.03(Mon)12:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

lisam wrote:
Well, so far so good. Everyone acting fine & the fuzz on the one Rasbora is gone. The remaining Oto is looking great & the single white spot on his tail is gone. Still questioning what the other little white spots are all over the wood, but will start a new post (hopefully with some pics) for that.

I'm going to cautiously back off on the water changes, maybe twice weekly VS daily, and see how it goes.

Have done some more reading on the algae situation & I think you're right about the poor advice - sort of a bummer, since my LFS usually is spot-on with advice. Sad

Thanks for all your support nikelodeon79!!

Lisa Smile


What did you do to make that fuzz gone???

I have these Rasbora Harlequins with the same fuzzy growth on their months. I have had them for quite a few weeks. 4 of them still how it.

I had a case of columnaris in a batch of Serpaes I bought in May and almost of all them died, but the remaining were treated succesfully with amoxicillin.

I have dosed planty of amoxicillin to the Rasboras. NOTHING.

Tried amoxicillin with clavulanic acid, which is the antibiotic of choice when treating penicillin resistant organisms, nothing.

I just bought the Jungle fungus clear and see if it works.

If it was columnaris they would be all dead by now, right?


I am doing 90% water changes every 2 days.
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