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Ammonia and nitrite oxidising bacteria
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unissuh
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Joined: 29 Mar 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: 2009.07.03(Fri)23:48    Post subject: Ammonia and nitrite oxidising bacteria Reply with quote

Some interesting papers I stumbled across the other day (some of you might've seen them before, they're a decade old!):

Ammonia oxidising bacteria:
http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/67/12/5791

Nitrosomonas marina seems to be the most common ammonia oxidising bacterium isolated in that paper, as opposed to the commonly touted Nitrosomonas europea.

Nitrite oxidising bacteria:
http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/64/1/258

Seems more like Nitrospira sp are the major players rather than Nitrobacter sp. There are also some interesting comments in the second paper regarding the use of "Cycle" (Nutrafin bacterial additive), mainly that it *does* seem to reduce the length of the nitrite spike.
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Ciklido
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Joined: 06 Aug 2005
Location: Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: 2009.07.04(Sat)9:14    Post subject: Reply with quote

cool, so basically the tank with the bacterial additive drops down nitrites to zeroe five days before the tank without the bacterial additive. So now you know if you want to be 5 days faster at cycling add it.

33 days for tank with Cycle, and 38 days (precisely) for non treated tank
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unissuh
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Joined: 29 Mar 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: 2009.07.04(Sat)19:50    Post subject: Reply with quote

To clarify what I meant:
Things in biological sciences tend to vary a lot, and n=1 is not really proof of anything. I guess the best I can say is that it is suggestive that Cycle may actually do something to nitrite spikes, as opposed to nothing.

Quote:
Results regarding the beneficial effects of the addition of a bacterial additive containing Nitrobacter species were equivocal. While nitrite levels in treated aquaria decreased earlier than those in nontreated aquaria, there was no evidence that Nitrobacter species were actively growing in these aquaria. It is possible that the levels of Nitrobacter species were below the limits of detection of our techniques. [...] It is possible that the addition of bacterial mixtures supplies vitamins and other nutrients which generally stimulate the growth of the nitrifying assemblages, fostering their growth and development and indirectly stimulating nitrite oxidation.


Another potentially interesting point is that Nitrosomonas marinum is also a marine ammonia oxidising bacteria - has anyone ever tried to jump start a cycle (the ammonia oxidising part) in saltwater tanks with freshwater filter material? The nitrite oxidising bacteria do not seem to survive the transition to saltwater (Figure 4 in the second paper).
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unissuh
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Joined: 29 Mar 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: 2012.03.01(Thu)16:26    Post subject: Reply with quote

...and wrong again!

New-ish publication suggests it's not bacteria at all which process ammonia in our fish tanks, but rather, archaea.

http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0023281

No wonder most bacteria-in-a-bottle products don't work, the "right" microorganisms keep changing.
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diademhill
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Joined: 18 Apr 2007

PostPosted: 2012.03.02(Fri)2:47    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you think there could be an element of "need to find something new" in some research? Just confirming known/ previous hypotheses won't do and why shouldn't multiple beings have evolved to perform in the same manner.

I'll stick to using dead shrimp Laughing

And I'm convinced the trace elements they add makes this method superior to using pure ammonia.
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unissuh
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Joined: 29 Mar 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: 2012.03.02(Fri)3:24    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ehh, apparently one of things you are supposed to do when writing research publications is talk your findings up rather than point out the flaws or how it is not "novel". Such is research, the better you write it, the more chances it has of getting better exposure, which adds to your track record. I think all research goes like this to be honest. I have trouble with it because apparently I have a too negative and/or critical outlook.

Agreed on the dead shrimp though - I prefer this method as it is more hands off than dosing pure ammonia.
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