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Sick Platys and Cories
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fuwafuwadesune
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Joined: 02 Oct 2008
Location: Florida

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)10:43    Post subject: Sick Platys and Cories Reply with quote

Problem:
I recently bought new Platys and Peppered Cories for my tank, which already had Albino Cories, Rasboras, and Otos. One of the platys is peppered on his back tail with salt-like things, I think it's ich Ich Platy. Another had a white speck over his eye that grew and started getting flaky. Eye Platy 1 Eye Platy 2. The other two Platys seem fine, but the orange mickey one with the spot over his eye is lethargic and standoffish for the most part. My new Cories are all fine. They'll get dots on them that turn out to be just sand, but one of the albino Cories seems to be losing scales on his tail Albino Cory. He freaks out and laps around the tank whenever he gets startled, so it might just be damage from flailing against everything, but it's only on one side and I'm concerned, could it be from the Rid-ich+? I've only done 1 dosage. Everyone else is fine, as far as I can tell. I'll include pictures of the new fish just in case I'm wrong.

Peppered Cory 1
Peppered Cory 2
Peppered Cory 3
Unsick Platy 1
Unsick Platy 2

Tank Specs:

My tank is 15 gallons, 15x12x15, approximately. I've had it for about 7 months.
The temp is 75-77F, Nitrites and Ammonia are 0 and pH is 6.8. I don't have a nitrate test
I use stress coat to dechlorinate the water. I don't change it on a schedule, but I did a 25% water change last night because I started treating with Rid-ich+

Tank Inhabitants:

Harlequin Rasboras - 4
Albino Corydoras - 3
Otocinclus - 2
New Peppered Corydoras - 3
New Platys - 1 red wag, 1 sunburst (sick), 1 Sunburst Mickey (sick), 1 Yellow Mickey

New Developments:

I recently purchased new fish 2 days ago, and a few of them developed ich spots.

Food:

I feed them blood worms every day (a few shakes) and drop 3 algae wafers every day. Both are Hikari brand.

Should I discontinue using Rid-ich+ because of my Albino Cory? None of the others seem affected, and it's supposed to be safe for catfish with scales, which is why I chose it. The spots on my ich-fish are not getting worse, but the spot above the platy's eye gets worse every time I look at it. Could he be sloughing off an ich parasite? I would really like to know what is ailing my fish and what I should do to fix it, before it starts affecting the others. Thank you to anyone who can offer me advice!
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Last edited by fuwafuwadesune on 2009.03.25(Wed)11:39; edited 1 time in total
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diademhill
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Joined: 18 Apr 2007

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)11:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please confirm your tank's dimensions and list any chemicals and quantities you have used. What is your water change schedule?

Two of the peppered cories look emaciated, the abino cory photo links to a pic of the eyeless platy.

Your red wag platy appears to have a white filminess which could indicate a bacterial or protozoan infection amd the ich diagnosis is correct.

Bloodworms and algae wafers should not be the staple diet. The otto will appreciate algae wafers a couple of times a week but the other fish will fare better on a sinking pellet food.
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deborah_claro
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Joined: 11 May 2006
Location: Virginia, USA

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)11:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please fix the photo link to the albino cory so we can see what's wrong with it. Corys don't have scales, but they have armor plates called scutes, and this may be what you see. Fix the link as soon as you can.

Meanwhile, please continue the Rid-Ick and follow the directions exactly. Do not overdose. Rid-Ick is a good product and it works fast. If your platy has Ich you need to treat the tank.

It's okay to use Rid-Ick with corys if you have to. They don't like it, but if you are careful and do not overdose he should be all right. You have no choice - the Ich parasite has been introduced to the tank, and all the fish could come down with it. You need to treat.

Turn up the heat a couple of degrees, and a couple more in a few hours. This speeds up the life cycle of the parasite by making the cysts fall off the fish sooner, and allows you to remove them from the tank faster with your water changes.

Simple version: The white dots are Ich cysts which contain many more "baby" parasites. You will need to siphon the substrate to remove any fallen cysts. Once the cysts burst open the Rid-Ick can attack them. Between the action of the med and your w/c's you should get most of them out. Do the water changes and siphon carefully to remove as many fallen cysts as possible.

It looks like you have the "eye platy" in a separate tub. What are you using in that?

I suggest you switch to a plain dechlorinator to treat your water. Stress Coat contains extra ingredients which irritate fish and force them to produce more slime coat. It's not a great idea.
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deborah_claro
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Joined: 11 May 2006
Location: Virginia, USA

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)11:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ichthyophthirius multifilis means "fish louse with many children."
Something to keep in mind when you're trying to get rid of it.

In the past I have used Rid-Ich and Quick Cure, and both seemed to work about the same. I have not needed to use either of these in years so I forget exactly how many days it says to use it, but complete the treatment. Do not stop halfway through.
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fuwafuwadesune
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Joined: 02 Oct 2008
Location: Florida

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)11:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a suspicion that the peppered cories hadn't been eating well at the fish store. The smallest one is barely a cm thick at his tail end. But they're getting enough food, I spread the wafers out. Thank you for confirming that, and I'm glad you were concerned.

The platy isn't eyeless, there's just something above his eye, it's hard to tell in that picture though. Here is the picture of my albino cory's tail, sorry for the mix-up. I'll also fix it in the first post.

Upon further inspection, the pellets I'm dropping are called 'Hikari Tropical Sinking Wafers' It says it's great for catfish, loaches, and bottom feeders. I thought they were algae wafers, but the ingredients are mostly fish meal and wheat germ meal, including 32% protein. So I guess I was wrong about the kind of food, but I'm glad you brought that to my attention. The otos don't eat it, so I was confused. I'm going to pick up some algae wafers for them as well.

[EDIT!] Also, should I be giving them tropical flakes in addition to the blood worms, or also giving them brine shrimp (which I also have, theyre just messier so I havent been using them)?

Also, I will continue the rid ich treatment, but I need some more advice on the substrate. Since I have cories, their substrate is extremely fine sand to protect their whiskers. It feels like flour, it's from caribsea, called moon sand or moonlight sand. If I siphon it, will all the sand come with it, or will it sink like regular gravel? I've never siphoned it before aside from de-snailing with my net, which I do every couple weeks. I'm pretty sure that won't be suitable for removing the parasites though. What do you suggest? I have a siphon for my betta tank, but I didn't know if the sand would get sucked up, and my cories and trumpet snails do a pretty good job of keeping it clean. That being said, I don't want the cories ingesting the parasites!

The eye platy doesn't let me take pictures of him unless I scoop him up, so I just scooped up some water from the tank and netted him for the pictures, then put him back. He's evasive, but he has been mostly avoiding the other fish as well, though when I brought him home they were all schooling together for a good few hours. I think this is because of the development on his face.

I also have a plain dechlorinator that I will begin using instead. Thank you for warning me, I was under the impression that it was good to boost their stress coat as a sort of immunization boost to keep away sickness.
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deborah_claro
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Joined: 11 May 2006
Location: Virginia, USA

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)15:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hold the siphon about three inches above the sand while you gently stir the top layer of the sand with your fingers, one section at a time. Do not stir vigorously. You don't want to accidentally let loose a gas bubble. Just do it slowly and deliberately and in no time you will have made one good pass over the whole bottom.

The albino cory looks awful. Have you been using EXCEL (liquid carbon) or something? It looks bad, but not infected. Probably an accident of some kind where the armor got scraped off. I'll look into it a little for you. There might be another cause. Meantime, for treatment I would say water changes and if you can use Melafix with Rid-Ich, I'd do it. I don't know if you can use the two together, maybe Sue knows. She probably does.Smile If not, keep everything very clean and hope things start to heal on their own.

My Panaque lost a lot of body armor in a tank accident, and regrew it all back. The treatment was small water changes frequently, high quality food, and Melafix for just a few days. I think there's a chance your cory will recover from this. Do what you can, be vigilant, but don't stress out.Very Happy

Quote:
I also have a plain dechlorinator that I will begin using instead. Thank you for warning me, I was under the impression that it was good to boost their stress coat as a sort of immunization boost to keep away sickness.
Not on a regular basis. It would be like you and me taking an anti-biotic every day whether we needed it or not. Maybe you can use Stress Coat occasionally, in times of stress, or when you introduce new fish. This product is good for shipping fish and wholesalers use products like this when they have large shipments of crowded bags of fish. In the day-to-day hobby aquarium it is not needed and, IMO, does harm.
Very Happy

Deborah
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fuwafuwadesune
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Joined: 02 Oct 2008
Location: Florida

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)17:45    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you very much, that was very helpful n_n

That cory is by far the biggest one, and he likes to assert himself by hogging a whole wafer when everyone else is trying to eat. I think one of the other cories has been sucking on him while he's hogging, they do it often. So, I think I'll pick up some amquel [EDIT: I mean melafix! I already have Amquel XD]. I havent been using excel, I try not to use chemicals other than dechlorinator. and I have pretty hardy plants X3

Does my platy have columnaris? Because I have medicine for that, I don't know if I can use it with the ich medicine though, is that risky? All of my fishes are suddenly sick =__= They were perfectly healthy until a few weeks ago. -sigh- Well! I am confident my fishes are strong enough to survive this!

[Edit 2: So, I've been watching my fish in sorrow about his tail, and there's no missing body armor. I think it was just because he was under a bridge so the lighting was skewed or something.. He's just pink there, they all are. Because they're albino, I think. But I even took him out and felt his tail, there's no missing armor, he feels fine and dandy. I^I I was worried for nothing. But thank you for your advice anyways, I know what to do if this actually happens.]
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fuwafuwadesune
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Joined: 02 Oct 2008
Location: Florida

PostPosted: 2009.03.25(Wed)18:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

My platy is worse! I'm very concerned, it's no longer white, I think there is a hole in his head. It's kind of like.. his scales on his head are flaking off. I believe the top of his eye may either be exposed or the skin over it is translucent now. The skin there is substantially shallower than on the other side. I will include pictures.

An entire half of his face is flaky and whitish along the edges of all the scales, and they're flaking off around his eye, which is fine. He is not swimming around, hasn't in a few days.

Is it Hexamita, and can this effect my other fish?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v504/Aenjell/Fish/IMG_0459.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v504/Aenjell/Fish/IMG_0458.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v504/Aenjell/Fish/IMG_0454.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v504/Aenjell/Fish/IMG_0453.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v504/Aenjell/Fish/IMG_0452.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v504/Aenjell/Fish/IMG_0451.jpg
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deborah_claro
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Joined: 11 May 2006
Location: Virginia, USA

PostPosted: 2009.03.26(Thu)9:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm glad to hear it was a false alarm about the albino cory. The photo was a little deceptive - the backlighting made the caudal peduncle look shrunken and the area was very pink, as if skin had been scraped off.
The adipose fin sticking up didn't help, either! It kind of emphasized the meager look at the base of the tail.

Now that the cory is okay I'm taking Melafix off the table.
The increased tank temps make using Melafix not as advisable, at this time.

I don't know what your platy has but maybe someone else does. It sounds and looks like some kind of erosion, but exactly what I don't know.
HITH, or HLLE, involves the lateral line.

Are you keeping him in the tank with the others?
Are you still treating that tank for Ich?
Are you still using Rid-Ich?

If you were using the heat-and-salt method, you could add other meds safely. With corys in the tank, salt is not advised, so Rid-Ich is a good choice.

So, stick with that, and raise the heat in the tank, again. You should have gotten the tank up to about 80dF by now, and by the end of the day you should be up to 82dF. Supposedly, the Ich parasite has trouble reproducing at 86dF but many tanks can't live at 86 for more than a couple of days, so see how they do at 82, and then raise it a little more.

Too many products in the water won't be a good situation.
Rather than add another med, I'd target feed your platy with a food that is fortified with Vitamin C. Look for a high quality staple food, that all your fish can eat, that specifically mentions extra Vitamin C. You can supplement the food with something like this:
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=4998

Or perhaps this:
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+4245+19682&pcatid=19682
This product is for marine systems but all it contains is water and Vitamin C, so I don't see how it could hurt.

TLC and clean water may save the day yet.
Keep us posted on how things are going.
Very Happy
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fuwafuwadesune
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Joined: 02 Oct 2008
Location: Florida

PostPosted: 2009.03.26(Thu)9:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, bad news. I didn't want to keep the fish in with the other ones, because his swimming declined and he was no longer able to keep up with the current in the tank (I have a high current in my tank). Now the flakiness covers his entire face here and here. It's really bad, it's like he's wearing a white flaky mask. He puts his nose to the wall of the container I have him in and swims at it, then begins to float vertically or lay on his side. He's also flashing against the walls of the tank. It looks like cotton, sort of, now that it's this developed. It's covering both of his eyes now, and he won't eat. This fish is declining fast. I don't want to put him back in the tank because he just floats on the current and looks like he's already dead and it's sad, and if this is contagious I don't want to expose my other fish to it if I can help it. What should I do?
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