Aquarium & Tropical Fish Site
Tropical Fish Forums
Aquarium fishkeeping around the world!
 
ChatChat  HelpHelp   Search BoardSearch Board   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   Check your private messagesCheck your private messages   Log inLog in   RegisterRegister 
Placing egg crate under live rock
 Forum Index > Marine Equipment and Chemistry  Reply to topic   Post new topic
Author Message
Jimbob
Regulars


Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Location: London, England

PostPosted: 2008.06.28(Sat)11:00    Post subject: Placing egg crate under live rock Reply with quote

I have been researching the option of using egg crate to lift my live rock up off the sand bed in my 68Ltr FOWLR tank. I am trying to get my head round whether the cells in the egg crate will still collect detrius. Do I need to fix legs to the egg crate to lift it off the bottom of the tank to generate flow underneath?

Set up details below:

Cleaner shrimp
_________________
Stand and deliver... your lupins or your life
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FloridaBoy
Moderators


Joined: 04 Jul 2004

PostPosted: 2008.06.29(Sun)16:40    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ahhh yes, the debate rages on about this... still, I have to ask---have you considered the impact of removing all the rock at this point? If you have no problems since 2006, why fix it?
Note the differing opinions below:
http://www.reefs.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=28&t=000005
_________________
Keepin' marines happy for 25 years
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jimbob
Regulars


Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Location: London, England

PostPosted: 2008.06.30(Mon)13:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see what you mean about the debate raging - most of the options and everything in between!

My main concern is that the nitrates have been creeping up closer to 10 than five and depending on which test kit I used this weekend looked more like they are nudging a little higher than that - despite following a methodical cleaning routine. My thinking behind this is I could get better access to below and between the live rock for cleaning by removing most of the sand apart from a thin layer. The flip side is disturbing all the fauna that has grown up around the base over the past twenty four months.

Not sure what to do now the goby must have made a leap out of the tank during cleaning over the weekend but didn't find him until just now - I was really thinking I was going to make two years without a fatality Sad
_________________
Stand and deliver... your lupins or your life
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FloridaBoy
Moderators


Joined: 04 Jul 2004

PostPosted: 2008.06.30(Mon)14:56    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adding more flow/turnover/circulation may help with detritus, you want to keep this material suspended until it is skimmed, trapped, removed. Add some mini-pumps behind that rock work.

The problem with a 1 inch sand bed is, it's deep enough to become a nasty nutrient sink (yuck) but not deep enough for denitrification (which lowers nitrates). Keep in mind, sand beds are always a subject of debate, mud slinging if you will. Last time I checked, I think the WWM site was suggesting beds either LESS than 1 inch or MORE than 3 inches. IMHO, substrates are often---I might even say USUALLY---the demise of marine systems. If you had more light you could add a Tridacna clam, they love nitrates.

Have you considered a refugium with a DSB, or veggie filter with macroalgae and reverse lighting? You need nutrient export.
Here are a couple of links to get you started...

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/deepsandbeds.htm
http://www.reefland.com/rho/0105/main2.php
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/sept2002/Editorial.htm
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-05/totm/index.php
_________________
Keepin' marines happy for 25 years
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jimbob
Regulars


Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Location: London, England

PostPosted: 2008.07.08(Tue)11:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for this FB - and for the links it has taken me sometime to go through all the information. I am begining to wonder whether I have exhusted the limits of this small tank and the time has come to upgrade?

I have been looking at the Eden Power Sweep 214 Powerhead - has anyone got any feedback or views on this piece of kit (or similar). The link is below:

http://www.aquatics-online.CO2.uk/catalogue/power-sweep-self-rotating-power-heads.asp

The medium term plan was to get as much of the equipment as possible out of the tank and into a sump - and I can build in a refugium with that plan. The long term plan is to use the 68Ltr as my QT and get a significantly better system in place.
_________________
Stand and deliver... your lupins or your life
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FloridaBoy
Moderators


Joined: 04 Jul 2004

PostPosted: 2008.07.09(Wed)16:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well yes, a 17 gallon system is very small, and considering your past success I think it's a good time to move into a larger system... a 29 gal is usually the smallest I recommend for marine setups, and something along the lines of a 40 or 75 gallon would be even better if you can swing it.
_________________
Keepin' marines happy for 25 years
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MarkLehr
Moderators


Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY

PostPosted: 2008.07.12(Sat)19:32    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my personal experience with marine systems and years in the hobby, I can agree with FloridaBoy. Substrate is very often the demise of a marine system. However, in my opinion, this is usually from lack of adequate sand sifters to maintain a sandbed of proper depth.

For example, just today I was in a marine shop that advertised a "clean up crew" for a 20 gallon tank. In this clean up crew were only 2 nassarius snails. This is not at all adequate to keep the sand stirred. I would personally use 8 to 10 nassarius snails in this setup.

This is one debate in the hobby that I honestly believe has been caused by a complete lack of proper information. To many newby marine hobbyists set up plenum systems with incorrect grain size, incorrect depth, and a lack of sand sifters. In the hands of an experienced hobbyist with systems that place aragonite sand directly on the bottom of the aquarium, at a 3'' to 4'' depth, and using adequate sand sifting critters, I have rarely seen anything other than good denitrification.

I should also point out that in systems using of a deep layer of aragonite sand, the testing of calcium and alkalinity become even more important to prevent the calcification of your substrate, especially in systems that utilize a kalk drip.

If all of these precautions are not going to be utilized, then I would agree that a bare bottom system is best.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Stixy
New Members


Joined: 04 Jan 2009

PostPosted: 2009.01.11(Sun)1:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

Um.. I also had problems with nitrates creeping, it turns out it was my substrate thickness, I used about just under an inch of Red Sea Reef base, week after week I couldn't get my nitrate levels down, tried everything until one day I was talking to my mate at my lfs and he asked how thick my substrate bed was and suggested another bag of reef base. I also brought a wrasse, can't remember what kind it was but it had black and pink stripes down it from head to tail, the wrasse used to sleep in the reef base at night and sift through it during the day, not sure whether it was the reef base or the wrasse but my nitrate levels began to drop after a few water changes. hop it helps.

also I used a powerhead similar to the one you just purchased but I think it was zoo med brand???? not sure but I had it sweeping just below the surface, worked a treat.
_________________
It must be the saltwater in my vanes.........
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
 Forum Index > Marine Equipment and Chemistry All times are GMT - 6 Hours Reply to topic   Post new topic
Jump to:  
  You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2008 phpBB Group

oF <=> oC in <=> cm G <=> L