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Theresa1
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Joined: 14 Jan 2008
Location: Oulu, Finland

PostPosted: 2008.03.05(Wed)15:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

No guys, there is just ONE thing that makes me angry, which happened here: Putting words into my mouth (or hands in this case) I haven't said/written.

And of course what I post is my opinion, what else should it be? Somebody elses opinion?

But since I am never going to put anything on videotape that is happening in my tank... I might as well step out of this forum I guess...
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Topper
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Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: 2008.03.05(Wed)16:23    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dusko wrote:

Quote:
It is funny you think like that, like this is personal.


It is personal. We have all taken on the responsibility of keeping fish to the best of our abilities. We all have opinions based on personal experiences and we all want to think that we are providing the optimal home for our charges. It is difficult to be told that we may have failed in some way in achieving these ends, and that is personal because the responsibility is ours and ours alone.

Let me just add...

I deal within academia and professors every day. It is amazing how such learned, intelligent individuals can disagree completely on subjects or topics where both have facts and experiences to back up their arguments. I have found that more often than not, both sides are correct to an extent.

It is commendable to passionately attempt to educate people on a subject that one is intimate and knowledgeable about. But we shouldn't forget that they are people - so it is personal.

Sorry to muck up this thread even more but I couldn't help myself.

Peace.
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CAllain
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Joined: 05 Jun 2007
Location: Berkshire, England

PostPosted: 2008.03.05(Wed)16:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was going to try to stay out of this a bit, but I guess now that it's over here, I may as well give my thoughts.

In a way, I agree that it is personal. I myself have said things that could have been better worded, and my first reaction when I was "reprimanded" was to take it personally. However, you have to understand the difference between it being a personal experience, or something that you're personally responsible for, and being personally attacked.

We've had the exact same problems where I work lately. Some people have been reacting too quickly and rashly to things, or taking criticism too personally, and it's been creating a bad atmosphere. Beforehand, criticism was taken more objectively, and we didn't have any issues.

To be completely honest, I see where people are coming from, but personally haven't seen what was quite so wrong with some of Theresa's posts. I don't want to side with anyone here (I'm very diplomatic - not sure if that's a good thing or not Wink ) but I've enjoyed seeing Theresa's input on this board. Isn't a forum here for everyone to share their own opinions and experiences freely? I'm not asking people to agree with those opinions or accept the advice given, but just to bear it in mind.

Personally, I like to hear all kinds of different experiences, then put it all together and draw my own conclusions. If one person can give facts, I'll be more likely to use their input more than another's, but I won't shoot down completely what the other person said, which is what seems to be happening to Theresa in some cases. I think there may have also been misinterpretation on both sides, but from an outside view, it does start to look a little like victimisation.

Anyway, I've blabbered on enough, and maybe too much, but I just wanted to give my opinion and say on one side, please try not to take things too personally, and on the other, maybe a little more understanding is in order? I know it can be a little frustrating, but I also work with "difficult" people and have learnt that you need to deal with these people differently than others. Just like different bettas have different care requirements, so do different people Wink


PS. Sorry if none of this makes sense any more, it's late, and I just wanted to blurt everything out

PPS. And just to clear it up, I'm not trying to say anyone here is difficult Shocked


Last edited by CAllain on 2008.03.05(Wed)17:05; edited 1 time in total
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nikelodeon79
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Joined: 08 Nov 2007
Location: Wisconsin, U.S.A.

PostPosted: 2008.03.05(Wed)17:01    Post subject: Reply with quote

Theresa, if I've questioned your findings (and we both know I have), it's because they are different from my own. I am not trying to say you're a liar, or even requiring proof. I merely want to obtain further information from you so I can see if I can explain why our results/experiences are so different.

I do believe you have the best interest of your fish in mind. That is a fishkeeper's philosophy rather than a fish haver's one, so I do believe you belong on this forum. Still, if you feel attacked all the time, that is not a good way to feel. If you feel it is in your best interest to leave, than perhaps you should. I would like it if you would keep in contact with me, however, as I would like to keep you updated on how my planted project is going. Wink
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Dusko
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Joined: 13 Feb 2006
Location: Denmark

PostPosted: 2008.03.05(Wed)17:06    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe it is rude hijacking someones thread and going on and on about "no one understands me" discussion/issue.

That thread wasn't started for your personal pleasure, what ever that might be (and I don't want to know), but to help me set-up my Cory tank.
Members asked you about certain things, so what!! You don't have to take it as an attack.
This is a discussion forum!

You wonder why members have problems with you and you have the answer already, you just have to look better into what you are writing;
Quote:
Of course I don't have proof for that, as I don't record everything that is going on in my tanks.

I believe you would like to be the "know it all" on a forum, and that is your freedom, but I also deserve my freedom to deny some of your statements, especially if I have tested many times with different water parameters.

number6 had a discussion with you, over in the Planted tank forum, and I thought for a while that he was a bit harsh with you (since you are new to this forum), so I stepped on your side.

BUT NOW, I apologise to number6 for doubting his judgement, he sure had a great hunch about you, and now I see it for my self.

I asked you nicely;
Quote:
and please Theresa try to find a better angle when approaching any member of this forum


But, instead you are continuing the farce in a thread started by me. Thank you for taking my private time for writing replies to you ( I sure could do better things in my life).

If you have something against Deborah's theory on gravel size for Corys, START ANOTHER THREAD, this forum is free to use, and every member has the right to post on AoA. Your discussion with Deborah was totally unproductive, on the other hand Deborah gave some superb replies, but you know "your way".

Quote:
I might as well step out of this forum I guess...

Lets be even more melodramatic shall we Wink
Dusko replies; "Oh no please don't go" Crying or Very sad

As always, kind regards, Dusko
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Scipio
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Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Location: The United States of America

PostPosted: 2008.03.05(Wed)18:04    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of course Dusko's thread belongs in the Bottom Dwellers Forum, it completley relates to the set forums title.

Dusko clearily stated in his introduction post that he had trouble with gravel in the past, and was wanting to use a sand substrate, and you posted about Cories and gravel. I too believe that Cories can be kept in smooth gravel, but its not ideal. There have been many reports on this forum of Cories behavior drastically changing (In a good way) when the aqurist switched from a gravel to sand.

It was rude of you to hijack Dusko's thread in such an unproductive way. Deborah is considered by many (including myself), the resident Cory expert, and I felt she wasn't initially rude to you. You escalated it into a pointless battle in the middle of Dusko's thread!

Theresa, please don't leave. Your input is just as valueable as any one elses, this is a public forum. I do however suggest that you read over your posts before you submit them; consider how the person you are responding to you may feel about it and it is also good to appologise and admit when you do something wrong.

Peace,
Scipio
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Slimy
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Joined: 20 Nov 2007

PostPosted: 2008.03.05(Wed)19:58    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think a lot has to be said for mis-communication. The whole point of a forum is to share information, experiences and opinions, regardless of whether they are conflicting or controversial. If we did not have this, we might as well all agree on everything, have our fish live 100 years and go to bed early.

From my standpoint Theresa can act overly defensive. When someone questions what she states her response is usually in terms of "Don't put things in my mouth" or "OK I guess I'm a lair then", etc... Without generally offering more explanations as to the issue at hand. I think this is the point that is leading to a lot of frustrations on both sides of the fence.

Responses like this do nothing to move the conversation forward and inevitably what could have been acceptable differences lead to a disruptive squabble.

I think it would serve her and everyone better if Theresa made an effort to be less defensive when someone doesn't agree with her. It is a discussion forum and people discuss things.

On the other side, as far as I am concerned knowledge should never preclude respect, nor does it give someone the right to tromp over people. Not even to Rex Grigg or Tom Barr Wink
There are a million ways to word the same sentence and there's really no excuse to be rude, or condescending.
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Dusko
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Joined: 13 Feb 2006
Location: Denmark

PostPosted: 2008.03.06(Thu)4:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slimy, in comparison with my reply above, you deserve the title Moderator more than I Very Happy For those who know me better, you know that I don't reply in such manner (as above), and this was the first time I did so. I apologise, I should calm my self down before posting the reply, but gosh...this was annoying Rolling Eyes

About Tom Barr, he doesn't write rude responses, he just hammers you down with facts, whether you like it or not, he hates myths and goes strait in the head when he sees one Wink
Thanks to people like Tom Barr, we all know better these days about aquatic gardening.
At the end of the day, this is not a kindergarden, but a discussion forum.

Regards, Dusko
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Jason L
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Joined: 18 Feb 2007
Location: Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: 2008.03.06(Thu)7:51    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can only be polite for so long. I commend you Dusko, for remaining so for the time you have. If some people can't take the "discussion" portion of a open forum, they can start their own web site, in which they can dictate whatever they want. I personally enjoy being challenged, it's how I learn.
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Slimy
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Joined: 20 Nov 2007

PostPosted: 2008.03.06(Thu)11:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I personally enjoy being challenged, it's how I learn.

If we all agreed it would be pointless and no fun Wink
The ability to challenge really has to go both ways. If I challenge your ideas I can't get upset and shut-down if you challenge mine... Otherwise I'm probably better off writing a book and never reading the reviews.
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