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Tank Talk of the Month! :-)
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Would you set up a Fish-Only Marine tank?
Sure, in fact I have one of those...
7%
 7%  [ 4 ]
Yes, I'd love to have a setup like that...
32%
 32%  [ 18 ]
Maybe, depending on certain factors...
35%
 35%  [ 20 ]
No, mostly because I prefer other styles...
23%
 23%  [ 13 ]
No, mostly because I have reservations against them...
1%
 1%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 56

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KDodds
Advisors


Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Location: Suffern, NY

PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)5:50    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have no problem with Fish Only tanks in general, but this specific tank is a very poor "role model" in that area. First of all, it's seriously overstocked, not only with too many fish, but with fish inappropriate for the set-up. There are species in there that are far too large and need far too much room. For some, even if you doubled the tank size, it would still be too small. Second, this tank advocates the collection of huge corals simply to kill and bleach them. This type of collection (as opposed to collection of small live fragments) can be extremely damaging to a reef and is, in fact, banned in many places. Keeping the tank looking as pristine (read: sterile) as it does is a maintenance nightmare as well. Lastly, the newest pictures of this tank portray different fish, with what appears to be some fish missing, and possibly dead. While this is not a guarantee, it would certainly not surprise me. This tank is a throwback to an era where keeping most marines was deemed impossible. Currently, the only marine fish we have trouble keeping, really, are those that get too large for us to house or those that we can not keep fed on a natural diet. I thought we were, in this hobby, progressing well beyond the death traps that were the tanks of the pre-Berlin era. The fish, as well, don't look all that great to me, particularly the newly added Powder Blue Tang, which already display the beginnings of color loss due to stress/inappropriate conditions.
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Kieron Dodds
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MattTVI
Exemplars


Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Woodstock, GA

PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)6:46    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't say much about the stocking issues, but it seems to me that all his corals are of the synthetic type... I.e. molds and not really corals that were once living in the ocean... I intend to buy just such a mold (of stag) for my tank as I plan on getting some chromis, and they seem to like hanging out in it... though after rereading his comments, he does indicate in "decorations" that he's using bleached corals... I'd be interested to hear if they are synthetic or not...
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KDodds
Advisors


Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Location: Suffern, NY

PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)7:58    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup, I read "bleached" as well, hence my concerns. Regardless, even if they are synthetics, it doesn't solve the other problems.
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Kieron Dodds
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MattTVI
Exemplars


Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Woodstock, GA

PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)8:41    Post subject: Reply with quote

What particular species are you saying aren't suited for his tank size? I noticed you didn't like the color on the pb... I thought he looked great, I even complimented Serg on the coloration!

btw, congrats on the advisor position... based on what I've read, you def. deserve the title!
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Last edited by MattTVI on 2005.05.05(Thu)8:49; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)8:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

the advance to keep a fish tank like this is because you can have fishes that you can not have in a reef tank, like angels, butterfly trigger etc.
another thing is because of the cost, most people can't afford a reef tank cause of chiller, skimmers, lighting, live rock etc.

This type of tank, is much unexpensive and is a great start for any hobbist.

the everoment is great to like a reef tank as you can see I have a powder blue tang and everybody know in a hard fish to keep, and I have him for 7 month alread and he's great.

There is just one fish missing in the photos, is the angel I gave him for my friend because he was getting to big for my tank.

I really think reef tank is much more beatiful then FO but let's think about the money . I prefer much more a 400 gallons FO than a 75 gallons reef and if you compare the total cost will be the same. for a 400g FO and a 75g reef.
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KDodds
Advisors


Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Location: Suffern, NY

PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)14:29    Post subject: Reply with quote

See my response to this last from <guest> Sergio here: http://www.aquahobby.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=21327&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=10

Other than the Angel that was removed, PBT and Yellow Tangs should have 6' tanks, something more on the order of a minimum of 125 for the Yellow and 180 for the PBT. Ditto for the Heniochus. I'm not sure what species the Wrasse is (hard to tell from the movement), but it could easily be a species that gets 12" or more. And, it's NEVER a good idea to mix Triggers (BTW, the Niger can get over 18") and Lions. If you look closely at the PBT, you'll notice paler areas on its flanks. This could be an artifact of the picture, but it really looks more to me like it's stress-related. PBTs should be a nice solid color, with no mottles or striping, not even of slightly lighter shading. Granted, I'm sure there are specimens that are "mismarked" that display something like this coloration normally, but the vast majority of PBTs should not show any "fading".
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Kieron Dodds
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KDodds
Advisors


Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Location: Suffern, NY

PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)18:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

To respond to your last post in the other thread, Sergio, the link you provided is for a commercial company that sells, sets up, and maintains aquariums. Most of what they do is commercial work. I'm not familiar with their work particularly, but the business they are in is known for it's lack of care and responsibility to the creatures they sell. Routinely, commercial displays are stocked and restocked and restocked. In fact, the fees for restocking are often built in to the monthly maintenance from the outset, the implication being that they EXPECT to kill fish. And they do. Collectively, these set ups must kill thousands of fish nationwide in the US per year. They are certainly NOT models to be emulating.
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Kieron Dodds
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drbdc
Members


Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Location: Ballwin, MO west St. Louis County

PostPosted: 2005.05.05(Thu)19:52    Post subject: Reply with quote

The more justification I hear and the reasoning that seems to be used, the madder I get about the blatent display of death and shameful husbandry practice.

Honestly I can't believe that this website placed this tank on it's site as tank of the month. Let's go ahead and put a tank from a bad LFS on with some dead fish floating too! Isn't that the same, a dead animals skeleton?
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MattTVI
Exemplars


Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Woodstock, GA

PostPosted: 2005.05.06(Fri)6:47    Post subject: Reply with quote

no it's not, in fact, it's nothing at all like that. All of Sergio's fish seem healthy (the tang has some white, but I thought that was due to ISO setting more than stress in the tank), and sergio may be planning to give the yellow, who is a slow grower (for a tang, anyway), back to the LFS or to a friend w/ a larger tank when the yellow gets too big for his current enviro. You may not agree w/ the tank drbdc, but to start comparing it to the beligerence you find in some LFSes is going a little too far.
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Jimbob
Regulars


Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Location: London, England

PostPosted: 2005.05.06(Fri)11:07    Post subject: Reply with quote

My only reservation with Marine is the conservation angle (and the cost) my LFS assure me that they will be stocking fish managed for the retail industry as opposed to removing them straight off the reefs. My concern, if it is true, is the conditions in which they are managed. That goes for 2nd generation corals etc produced for the same reasons.
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